You should realize that Java (JVM and libraries) is completely open source (GPL). Oracle JDK is just another build of OpenJDK.
This means the ecosystem is not tied to a vendor: if you build your systems on Java, you are your own master.
Also, as pointed out elsewhere in this thread, Java has a colossal momentum in just about every space outside Microsoft's sphere of influence. It would seem Oracle is trying, but it'll be very difficult to kill Java.
Besides, it's not a bad language, if you avoid the most common anti-patterns.
Suing Google because of Android is beyond stupid. Android breathes life into what could become an enterprise/legacy-only ecosystem in a very short time and, from that point, it's a slow descent into irrelevance. Oracle should embrace Java developers and make it as easy as possible for them to write Java applications for everything, not only server workloads.
We quickly forget the technologies we don't see in front of us. It's been 3 years since I wrote my last line of Java code for a web application. I wouldn't choose Java for the kinds of application I am doing.
Well no. You can't just take someone's work and then use "we're breathing life into your ecosystem" as an excuse.
Java makes sense for some applications, probably not for what you're doing. I mean if you want to pick a stack on the server (not talking about websites) that's in wide use, has a big pool of programmers to choose from and capable tooling what can you pick? Java and .NET pretty much and the latter is getting super-expensive as many here will testify.
If Google decided to turn Android around and use, say, Go, as its main development language, do you think there would be many new developers willing to learn Java?
As it is now we are already at a point not that many people are willing/eager to learn Java. Push it further and it becomes COBOL.
It's not about what Google did. It's about whether it benefits the Java ecosystem or not.
There is no shortage now, but every segment where Java ceases to be a viable option is one less reason to learn it. If Google decides to move on to something else, less people will be interested in learning Java, which was the original point of this discussion: whether Google's use of Java was beneficial to Sun and Oracle. Oracle's decision to sue indicates Google's use of Java was, somehow, detrimental while I have a strong impression it's the exact opposite: Google kept Java viable in mobile computing and Oracle benefits from the network effects. J2ME is not a credible revenue source these days.
For the last couple years, all Java code I wrote was intended to run on Android devices. If it weren't for Android, I'd have no reason whatsoever to bother doing it.
> J2ME is not a credible revenue source these days.
You mean Bluray licenses, Smart cards, embedded devices, car infotainment systems, radio controlled temperature meters, factory assembly line controllers .... ?
> For the last couple years, all Java code I wrote was intended to run on Android devices. If it weren't for Android, I'd have no reason whatsoever to bother doing it.
I take you don't work in the enterprise world, then.
> You mean Bluray licenses, Smart cards, embedded devices, car infotainment systems, radio controlled temperature meters, factory assembly line controllers .... ?
Do you have the numbers? For me, smartcards excepted, all those things based on J2ME are on their way out.
Thus letting Google go with their "I don't want to pay" attitude?!
It is not like Google is a poor startup trying to get some product out of the ground. Maybe they even have paid more to their layers as they would have paid in licenses.
If it was right for Microsoft, it should be for Google as well.
As for choosing Java or not, there are lots of areas in the industry right now where the JVM is the only game in town, as I mentioned in another thread.
The companies with money outside FOSS freebies, don't care about this.
I wouldn't be so hasty in thinking that. Java is catching up considerably with Java 8, and if you combine that with Guava extensions it can at times feel like a modern language.
Nah, it's too late for that as others have pointed out. It's a shame Microsoft didn't embrace cross-platform earlier on or things would be very different right now.
